E-85 fuel

[camaro1]

anyone mess around with this fuel yet??

i filled up the s-10 with it just for the hell of it,, i know your supposed to go bigger jets, there is a formula on the net, and no rubber fuel lines(stainless prefered), plastic tank is suggested, carb is supposed to be set up for running alcohol

just wanted to see how it ran before i put any $$ into new fuel lines and carb jetting, ran it 50 miles with no issues, it takes more pumping to get it started cold

[12secminivan]

It works well as a replacement fuel. It works great if you tune for it. In fact you can produce some impressive HP numbers with it as it is less prone to detionation than 93 octaine.

[camaro1]

i think it has an octane rating of 105-110 and it is $2.85 gal here in rapids

[1badtgp]

So, what do I have to do to run it in a carb'd vehicle? I'm thinking of using it in the bike.

[camaro1]

So, what do I have to do to run it in a carb'd vehicle? I'm thinking of using it in the bike.


it is 85% alcohol so no rubber lines, carb has to be jetted richer(and gaskets changed to alcohol compatible), plastic tank, stainless lines, good quality braided lines would probly be ok if they are ok with alcohol

i dont know how long it would take to break down rubber lines or a carb that isnt set up for alcohol, im trying it on my s-10 right now, it has a plastic tank with the original in tank fuel pump, some steel and some rubber lines and a edelbrock carb, so far i havent changed the jets yet and it is running ok, probly very lean

they say it will draw the moisture out of the air, and water and alcohol will mix so it will run moisture through your pump and lines making it corrosive

[YAV8]

Most of the vehicals made in the last 25 years have been able to run on a 10% blend that almost ever station has as a mid grade. Your fuel system will handle the E-85 with no problem. You are getting the E-85 mixed up with methonol that fuel has the problems but a much higher octane than E-85. You will need to up the jetting for the fuel. I think some place has the converson for it. My next motor for my self 406 SBC 11.6-1 in a ????? with a ????trans. I think around here the price is $2.00 a gal.

[96capricemgr]

Ethanol is still corrosive just not as bad as methanol.
As a fossil fuel alternative this crap is so bad even the EPA has pulled backing for it. As a hotrod fuel though it might be OK.

Stochimetric AFR for gas is 14.7 we all knew that right? Well ethanol is 9.0 so a larger fuel pump may be in order as well. Some of the new flex fuel cars are able to make more power on E85 BUT even their number have fuel economy down 30+% as compared to gas.

[Kevin Garceau]

it is 85% alcohol so no rubber lines, carb has to be jetted richer(and gaskets changed to alcohol compatible), plastic tank, stainless lines, good quality braided lines would probly be ok if they are ok with alcohol

I run straight meth with alum fuel cell, braided lines, typical standard ARP type fittings, my lines from my barrel valve to my injectors are standard rubber, all the manufacturers Rons, Kinsler, etc are set up this way.

Dont believe all the hype you hear.

[68Bowtie]

According to what i've seen the e-85 is like 105 octane.

[BLUE66]

Kevin do you drain your fuel after every racing event and run gas in it, or do you leave it in like a street car would have fuel in it all the time?

[camaro1]

i increased my jet size diameter about 27% and it runs just like normal gasoline, you could tell before it just had a slight lean stumble to it but was driveable

[superjeep]

So if I run all metal lines I can run this stuff.Will this stuff hurt your gaskets?or carb? You probably can't mix it with normal gas can you?

[YAV8]

As more people are using the E-85 I have talked to 6 people that have run it most of the time in there vehicals. 4 said no change in milage 1 said it increased and the last one was a school teacher and didn't have a clue what was happening. So far it sounds like its working OK, I am hopeing that my next vehical will be a E-85 vehical, it works for me. Most of the dume and glume you hear are from uninformed people.

[rscamaro_306]

would there be any way to run this stuff on my tbi set up or would i have to change to carb. i whant to run a carb anyways but would like the lower prices.

[BLUE66]

I would like to see the inside of an aluminum fuel cell, or carb, after a 1yr or so of e-85 being in it.....

[juniorhd3]

I would like to see the inside of an aluminum fuel cell, or carb, after a 1yr or so of e-85 being in it.....


Ethanol is not as corrosive as methanol. Any metal lines are fine. It is however hard on rubber and plastic after time. It is 105 pump octane. You can run a 12-1 or 13-1 motor on it. It doesnt burn as hot as gas,so you will not get the milage as regular gas. You will also have to jet up approx 10%. There is an article in the back of a newer car craft about it.

[badass88gt]

What about braided lines? Theyre still rubber inside. Could I run it on my car, with braided lines and just change the jetting? Its as simple as that?

I do have an air/fuel meter so I can jet appropriately.

[camaro1]

everyone's set up is a little different, i just put it in and ran it, it was lean but driveable, an article i found said to multiply your jet diameter by 1.27 and this is what i did and is running great, feels the same as running on regular gasoline

as far as rubber lines go i wouldnt worry, im going to just check mine every now and then

as far as running it on your tbi engine you would have to have a seperate tune for straight e-85 that would increase your injector pulse 20-30%

[96capricemgr]

It is science that E85 will get worse milage, ethanol contains fewer BTUs.
Ethanol averages about 80,00BTUs and gasoline more like 120,000BTUs per gallon. Internal combustion engines are all about turning heat into torque, less heat means less torque, BUT alcohol brings in some oxygen with it allowing you to properly burn a larger volume of it which is where it can generate more heat to expand the combustion gasses and the power gains can come from, the higher octane can help IF the engine is built and tuned to take advantage of octane. MANY people think octane makes power but it does not, it is JUST rsistance to detonation which can let you run more compression which will net more power and will let you advance timing which MIGHT make more power but people often get carried away with that too.

If someone is getting the same milage on gas and E85 something is either wrong and it is not running right on gas, they really want to believe and are driving differntly accounting for some difference or they are just stupid and can't tell the difference(this accounts for the majority of society today).

[rscamaro_306]

everyone's set up is a little different, i just put it in and ran it, it was lean but driveable, an article i found said to multiply your jet diameter by 1.27 and this is what i did and is running great, feels the same as running on regular gasoline

as far as rubber lines go i wouldnt worry, im going to just check mine every now and then

as far as running it on your tbi engine you would have to have a seperate tune for straight e-85 that would increase your injector pulse 20-30%

so in other words its not realy worth it or would the cheeper fuel and more octan help in the long run on money and power. i have my timing so fare advanced that i could probly easly run the higher octan. but its probly not worth the hasle doing it with a tbi set up is it?

[Randy Schonscheck]

For what the ethanol refineries pay farmers for their corn, ethanol should be 1/3 of what it is now. Last winter and ealy spring they were paying 2.80 to 3.00 a bushel, now it's about 1.80 a bushel. Cheap ass bastards. Myself, I would not even consider E85 in my Camaro or any other performance car. The consistancy of petroleum fuel is bad enough. I would also think damp and winter time conditions would cause alot of problems with water in the fuel tanks. I know there are outboard dealers who have had customers put E85 in their 3 year old motor and have it burndown and expect the dealer to fix it because they(the dealer) didn't "tell them" they could not use it in their Merc outboard. I guess they expect the dealer to hold their hand through their boat operation. These are the same people who use the cheapest oil they can buy and then wonder why the motor goes away.

[Fireballferkey]

For what the ethanol refineries pay farmers for their corn, ethanol should be 1/3 of what it is now.
Talk to the state of WI they will not allow it to sell for less and they cant go over 85%ethanol or else the state will tax them for an alchool tax and no Im not joking about this thats the way it is.

[Kevin Garceau]

Wrong. Doyle just stated he will not enforce the minimum cost for E85. He doesnt consider it gasoline so it shouldnt fall under the same scenario as gasoline. He also says getting more alt fuels on the market is a good thing so he wont stand in the way. Besides he states that with the amount of corn growers in wisconsin this is a win win situation.

Google E85 Monroe Wisconsin you will find a large article on it. I will see if I can find it as well.

[Kevin Garceau]

By STEVEN WALTERS
swalters@journalsentinel.com
Posted: Aug. 8, 2006

Madison - Gov. Jim Doyle on Tuesday ordered state regulators to not enforce the minimum markup law for ethanol blends of gasoline, an increasingly popular fuel required in southeast Wisconsin to fight pollution.


"Wisconsin is emerging as a leader in ethanol and other renewable fuels, and we need to build on that momentum," Doyle said in a statement.

"I want to send a clear message to producers and consumers of ethanol that the State of Wisconsin will not do anything to artificially drive up the price."



Doyle told state Department of Agriculture, Trade and Consumer Protection regulators not to enforce for ethanol-based fuels the 1930s-era law that requires that gas prices go up by 9.18% between w****salers and retailers.

He said the law artificially raises the cost of ethanol-blended fuels compared with petroleum-only fuel. After its 51-cent per gallon federal subsidy, ethanol is selling at the w****sale level for $1.37 per gallon - almost half the $2.60 per gallon price of petroleum, Doyle said.

The Legislature this year debated but failed to pass a measure that would have repealed the minimum markup law for all fuels - a bill the governor said he would have signed into law.

"More and more drivers are turning to ethanol-based fuels because they are cheaper, and that is a trend we want to continue," Doyle said.

Nearly half the vehicle fuel sold in Wisconsin contains a 10% blend of ethanol - or E-10 - with most of it used in the Milwaukee area because of air pollution regulations.

Managers of Milwaukee-area service stations late Tuesday said that it was too early to know what impact the decision would have on local gas prices.

Decision criticized
The governor's order was an election-year gift to ethanol producers, said Erin Roth, of the American Petroleum Institute, which represents major oil companies. He said that the move could hurt those convenience stores and other retailers who don't sell ethanol-blended fuel as price-weary consumers shop for the lowest prices.

"It's an incentive for people to buy ethanol-blended gasoline," Roth said. "He ought to do it on all fuels."

Bob Bartlett, president of the Wisconsin Petroleum Marketers and Convenience Store Association, which represents 2,000 gas retailers, said he could not predict what gas prices drivers will see over the next few days and whether retailers who sell an ethanol blend will have an advantage.

"It's kind of unprecedented," Bartlett said. "I don't have the facts to know what to predict."

Although the governor can't unilaterally kill the minimum markup law, he can "set the priorities" of regulators who act on complaints about violations of the law, said Doyle spokesman Dan Leistikow. Ethanol "didn't even exist" when that law was passed decades ago, Leistikow said.

Doyle's order comes amid concerns over higher prices because of the shutdown of a major Alaskan oil pipeline. Milwaukee-area gas prices ranged from $3.13 to $3.29 per gallon of regular unleaded, according to the Internet site milwaukeegasprices.com.

Bartlett said that the order only "added to the confusion" over the minimum markup law and how it works.

He and other lobbyists for convenience stores and retailers told legislators that the law protects family-owned businesses against giant retailers, who could begin selling fuel at prices that would wipe out independent retailers across Wisconsin.

"The (minimum markup) law isn't the culprit for our energy crisis," Bartlett added. "We are in a national and global economy."

But Gary Kramer, president of Badger State Ethanol, quickly responded to the governor's order by lowering the price of unleaded regular fuel with 10% ethanol from $3.11 per gallon to $2.91 at his Monroe business.

Badger State Ethanol produces 50 million gallons of "fuel-grade ethanol" a year, which is sold nationally, Kramer said. It also sells fuel at its Monroe gas station.

Kramer said he kept his price for E-85, a blend of fuel with more ethanol but which can only be used in specially built flexible-fuel vehicles, at $2.15 per gallon.

A "minuscule" number of Wisconsin vehicles are equipped to drive on E-85, Roth said.

"We're very pleased," said Kramer, who said the minimum markup law had kept him from dropping his price on fuel with 10% ethanol, a byproduct of corn.

The Legislature debated a controversial bill - pushed by corn farmers and the state's growing ethanol industry - that would have required fuel with 10% alcohol to be sold statewide, but it died in the state Senate.

Earlier Tuesday, Doyle's Republican challenger, U.S. Rep. Mark Green of Green Bay, called on the state to end an investigation into Kramer's gas station for selling an ethanol-blend for less than those of his competitors who do not use ethanol blends.

"With the price of oil climbing higher and higher, we should be encouraging more use of alternative fuel," Green said in a statement.

Green and Doyle sided with Kramer - an election-year rarity.

Doyle noted that the Department of Agriculture, Trade and Consumer Protection had looked at Badger State Ethanol but had decided that no action was necessary.

Doyle said ethanol "can break the stranglehold the big oil companies have on us," a squeeze he argued is made worse by the minimum markup law.

"If a cornfield in Monroe is competing against an oil field in Saudi Arabia, that's a very good thing for Wisconsin," he added.

[Randy Schonscheck]

Thanks, Kevin! Interesting article.

[Kevin Garceau]

I have kept my fuel in it over the winter. I do take precautions to some of the lines and now that I have a Rupert carb there will be a few things I will do to keep the small orifices from having issues over the winter. But I will keep alky in the cell all winter and not have any issues.

Heck I havent ran this new car since mid july and still have all the alky in it.

[Kevin Garceau]

We as consumers need to lesson our dependance. If something like this continues to happen I see a few things in the future.

1. I think E85 will actually go down in price, more people producing it, more and better ways to produce it at a cheaper cost.

2. Vehicles will begin to be built around this platform which would increase their performance and mileage, which would sell more and fuel the growth of this fuel.

3. Farmers will benefit from it two fold. They will have a surefire sale each year, and from what I hear the corn by-product from this process is actually better for the cattle as it has the harmful alcohol sugars removed.

[96capricemgr]

Ethanol can't make a dent in our oil usage. North America does not have sufficient land with yearround growing season not to mention corn is not even a particularly good plantr to start with. Brazil is often sited as the big ethanol user BUT they make it from sugar cane grown yearround and if you look into the details they are at about 20% ethanol for motor fuels but they are smart enough to continue to develope their own oil resources. Just a few years back they had a bad growing season and were buying ethanol from us. Another thing you folks need to consider. Look how erratic corn production can be, one year is so wet the seed rots in the ground the next it turns brown from drought, you ***** about oil prices imagine what a bad growing season would do to fuel prices.
Ethanol needs to be lumped into the same caragory as gun control USELESS feelgood politics where the ignorant masses want to believe a difference is being made but the end result is a negative. Now if they would put some more effort into ethanol from garbage then it becomes less of a bad idea killing two birds with one stone as it would reducing waste going to landfills.

I already posted BTU contents of each fuel that is a measure of the energy content, long as we stick with reciprocating internal combustion engines a gallon of ethanol will not get you the same distance as a gallon of gas, if you can't understand that go back to 8th grade science class and ask one of the kids.

Those who care to truely understand this quickly see how ethanol in it's current form of production at least is a BAD idea but most prefer the "feelgood" side of things which the politicians spout because the ADM lobbyists pay them well too. Archer Daniels Middland the company that controls the majority of ethanol production. The reason ethanol is so big in the news and stuff now is after the EPA pulled recommendations and requirements for the crap ADM saw a monopoly slipping away and started lobbying politicians HARD to mandate it at the state levels since the EPA was not doing so anymore.

The studies I have read for efficiency of ethanol production range from 4:1 energy used to gotten on the bad side to even the most optomistic pro-ethanol study saying a 37% gain. I think it safe to say the real number lies somewhere in between BUT there is a whole lot more negative number in between than positive. Fossil fuels are used in the production as well as HUGE amounts of water, then you have issues like in the Milwaukee area a couple years ago where a producer got sloppy with the sulfuric acid remoal and it started wiping out fuel injectors regionally.

Do some research and try to read BOTH sides if you do so with an open mind and one that considers which sides viwes you are reading I think most of you will be shocked.

[NEW BUILD]

I work at a local garage in fondy and i have seen a few flex fuel vehicals come in.Asked the customer if noticed any difference they said YES.So I asked good or bad.So far BAD,one noticed when running e85 check engine light comes on a lot referencing 02 sensors.When runns regular gas no problem.Also mileage is 40 miles less with e85 per tank.Another said motor don't sound right when driven with e85.So as far as im concerned e85 is fuel to stay away from until its a proven HELP.

[BP Convt]

96capricemgr....You seem to have the blind folders on. I toured the ethanol plant in Oshkosh, WI and was quite impressed. There will also be a bigger ethanol plant in Jefferson within a year.

There is a .60 cent rule of thumb with E85. E85 has to be .60 cents less than gasoline for you to break even on mileage. E85 @ $1.99 vs. Gasoline @ $3 per gallon. You go back to 8th grade and do the math.

I'm putting E85 into my new '07 Suburban on Monday. More horsepower due to the PCM programming on alcohol, less fuel cost at the current prices, keep the farmers going, reduce dependancy on foreign oil and less emissions than gasoline. This all sounds like a win-win.

Saab actually produced a prototype turbocharged engine that gets better fuel economy when running ethanol than gasoline. We have just begun to scratch the surface of ethanol technology. You'll see more efficient plants and more efficient engines real soon. Distribution is getting bigger every year as stations begin to open up.

Ethanol is not the entire answer to our dependance on foreign oil. Hybrid technology and hydrogen fuel cells are the more long term solutions. However, I firmly believe that ethanol is a great alternative to gasoline. Especially in Wisconsin.

[DRK]

^^it's also ALOT cheaper then race gas.^^

We run methanol in the indy car with a fuel bladder, rubber (braided) and aluminum lines, and all aluminum motor. We drain it after every race weekend and have had no problems. It's also dirt cheap $1.33 a gal.

As far as Gasoline, I have seen race gas eat fuel bladders and rubber over time. That stuff turns into a corrosive poision when it sits, especailly the sunoco stuff.

[rscamaro_306]

sooooooo is it safe and worth it to run in my tbi 305 or would i need major moods to run it and would i save on the $$$ department over 93oct gas. and would i see some incres in power if it is safe or would it gust not be worth it.

[DRK]

No. No. No,and No

[rscamaro_306]

OK ! thanks gust asking. no one realy answerd me last time i asked. oh well thanks.

[96capricemgr]

BP Convert I would argue you just eat up all the false hype. Far as the Saab motor how do they get better milage when as I posted the BTU content is drastically less, that is the measure of energy content.

Far as more power yes that is possible BUT BURNING A LOT MORE which is possible because it contains some oxygen with which to burn, ask someone with an alky racecar yes they make more power but also burn like 2.5 times as much.
The $.60 cent rule is generally good IF talking only about what you pay to drive BUT it neglects the huge subsidies that come out of our tax dollars.

What needs to be done is develope our own oil resourses, soon as we do the cost of foreign crude will plummet and we can pump them dry while continuing to develope our own. Canada is already fixing to be the next Saudi Arabia as far as oil producion and we have at least as much as them, far MORE than the middle east just not as easy to get too, but at todays prices it is fesible. Problem is the same jackasses that drive an SUV that has to be 4wd and never has more than 1 person and never so much as drives on grass are the ones stopping us from developing our own oil. Garbage can be turned into ethanol or crude oil those would be useful, growing corn is JUST politicians buying votes after lobbyist bought the politician, it is not an environmentally positive alternative.

Crops fail garbage production in the US aint going to slow anytime soon as I said earlier kill two birds................

[1SLO5.0]

It doesn't matter how much oil we can find or produce. That has nothing to do with the price of fuel. Its all about the money and that is it. Gas will never be below $2.79 a gallon ever again. Every oil producing country has unbelieveably cheap gas EXCEPT the U.S. Its U.S. companies that are raping the public, not the Saudi's or any other foriegn country.

[Kevin Garceau]

ask someone with an alky racecar yes they make more power but also burn like 2.5 times as much.

Wrong.

I do believe I would know, we have 4 of them.

[BP Convt]

The $.60 cent rule is generally good IF talking only about what you pay to drive BUT it neglects the huge subsidies that come out of our tax dollars.


And like the U.S. is not subsidizing foreign oil into the U.S. The U.S. pays huge amounts of tax money to the Middle East so that we can enjoy our $3 per gallon gasoline. The tax money to ethanol is miniscule in comparison. And who would you rather put your tax dollars to, the Middle East or United States farmers? And if you take into consideration putting the troops into the Middle East to eliminate the terrorism and keep our "cheap" oil, are we really that far ahead with our tax dollars? Corn is just one source for making ethanol. There are other sources too. The negative energy arguement is not valid either with Today's ethanol production technology There is alot to debate here.

[YAV8]

Build a 406 with 11.5-1 compression and through some gear in it and beat he hell out of it and have some fun, Hell for the $2 a gallon price who cars that makes what or where it comes from. Quit the wineing and crying and sit down strap in and shut up. Things always go better with COMPRESSION.

[Kevin Garceau]

Alot of propoganda on both sides.

I hear the negative energy thing. It may be true now. But if this fuel does take off. The cost to produce will continue to get less.

[96capricemgr]

Kevin,
Stoichimetric ratio for Methanol is 6.4 and a gallon contains 63,000BTUs. So Stoich is more than twice as rich and it contains half the energy of gasoline per gallon and you claim not to burn a whole hell of a lot more of it. Science here I am offering facts to backup my claims not hearsay or blind belief in propoganda.

YAV8 I already run 11.5:1 maybe a little higher because that is asuming .025 down in the hole and we measured .022, runs great on 93 octane only a 350 but give me a year or two and I will put a shortblock under it. Gets upper teens for milage too even with 3400 stall and 3.73s and that includes racing on most fillups either WIR or GLD. O2s are a couple years old bet I can pickup a little more milage with fresh ones as the wideband shows it is 14.5-7 at cruise, if I get funky with the programming I could easily push it over 20mpg by running it lean at cruise I am not brave enough to push the exessively high silicon content and therefore brittle pistons that hard though, they are strong but detonation is the fastest way to crack them.

[YAV8]

I don't have aluminum heads or a computer to cut back the timing. You can never have to much compression, just not enough of the right fuel. I think this E-85 thing can be a lot of fun. It sure beats 9.5-1 and iron heads. See you tomorrow at the T&T.

[Kevin Garceau]

Do you run Alky in a race car?

didnt think so. I DO NOT use 2.5 times as much. Science on paper has been proven wrong over and over in the real world.

[Wicked]

I have a 91 ExploDer that has 83,000 miles on and I have been runnign E-85 for 2100 miles now with no problems. At $1.99 a gallon you can't beat it. I get 22 MPG with a 4.0L 5 speed 4wd . I think thats impressive!

[BP Convt]

I figure I will save $18 for every 540 miles I drive on E85 if gasoline is $2.99 and E85 is $1.99. I can get 18 mpg on the highway in the '07 Suburban with gasoline. I can get 15 mpg on the highway with E85. I've got a 30 gallon tank.

Gasoline: 18 mpg x 30 gallons = 540 miles. 30 gallons x $2.99 = $89.70
E85: 15 mpg x 36 gallons = 540 miles. 36 gallons x $1.99 = $71.64

The Renew 85 people are hoping to put a station across from Menards on the East side of Green Bay. They are also hoping to put another station either off 41 or 441, but are trying to get the right location.

I'm probably going to build the fuel system for my carb'd '84 Mustang to run on E85 since I'll need the extra octane with 11 to 1 compression and iron heads. I'm hooked on E85.

[96capricemgr]

I don't have aluminum heads or a computer to cut back the timing. You can never have to much compression, just not enough of the right fuel. I think this E-85 thing can be a lot of fun. It sure beats 9.5-1 and iron heads. See you tomorrow at the T&T.
Yes I have aluminum heads BUT being a stock shortblock quench is about .048 not particularly ideal and I am running mid 30s for WOT timing so it aint like that is cutback to account for compression.

Far as do I run alky in a racecar no I don't I run 93 octane in a solid 12 second daily driver. I also know enough to know just because someone races or even assembles their own motors doesn't mean they know a damn thing about engines. I have honestly had guys with decades of racing under their belt swear they get more displacement from longer rods and other such stupidity. I have turned some wrenches on an alky car up at Shawano and I know we went through a whole lot more fuel than the cars that ran racegas, granted the engines were not the same but the difference was still apparent.

[Kevin Garceau]

Scientists used to say the world was flat.

Now they are saying there may be 12 planets in our solar system.

Who knows, maybe an alky car really doesnt burn 2.5 times as much as your scientific data states.

[96capricemgr]

You are the ONLY person to run alky who I have ever heard dispute that my guess is the issue here is your own lack of knowledge. Like I said I have spoken to a lot of "racers" who don't know **** about what they operate e ven when they are the primary mechanic. They are like dealer techs just parts replacers with no real understanding of the science behind it all.

[DRK]

It's a hell of a lot cheaper then race gas :)

[Kevin Garceau]

Im not saying it doesnt use more than race gas. Just not 2.5 times as much.

Heck I can set up my car to run faster with alky than gas, and use less alky than gas. But thats not the point. Because with my primer plus I actually drive around the pits on gas and switch to alky before the burnout, and after the run before the return road.

[superjeep]

So if I run all metal lines in my s-10 with my vortec 5.7 will it be ok? Besides risking the carb.

[Fireballferkey]

So if I run all metal lines in my s-10 with my vortec 5.7 will it be ok? Besides risking the carb.
Not just any metal the sweet shinny stuff called STAINLESS... :rockon1:

[Slow Ride]

Not just any metal the sweet shinny stuff called STAINLESS... :rockon1:

You forgot expensive too

[Fireballferkey]

You forgot expensive too
Stainless is like women you dont care what it costs as long as its sweet and shinny ahaha :angel: .

[superjeep]

Hmmmm....... I will worry about gas later. Only need a few more things to finish my truck :rockon1:

[Stud]

It doesn't matter how much oil we can find or produce. That has nothing to do with the price of fuel. Its all about the money and that is it. Gas will never be below $2.79 a gallon ever again. Every oil producing country has unbelieveably cheap gas EXCEPT the U.S. Its U.S. companies that are raping the public, not the Saudi's or any other foriegn country.


For some reason I remembered this quote and it stuck in my head.
I just have to ask if Darrell seen gas prices lately? :hello:

[1SLO5.0]

For some reason I remembered this quote and it stuck in my head.
I just have to ask if Darrell seen gas prices lately? :hello:


I am just as amazed as you, however OPEC just stated that they are cutting oil production in half to drive the price back up.....

The sad thing is we now think $2.29 a gallon is "cheap". Lord have mercy.

[Rick Finsta]

Heck I can set up my car to run faster with alky than gas, and use less alky than gas.

No you can't. No one can. Gasoline contains more BTU's per gallon. The reason you can make more power with Methanol, Ethanol, or a Nitromethane mixture is because the oxidation occurs at a richer ratio. That means you can burn more of it. END OF STORY. If you burned a gallon of gasoline and a gallon of nitromethane, guess which gets you more energy? The gasoline would release nearly three and a half times as much. Same story with alcohols: Gasoline contains more energy, and therefore you cannot make a power gain without burning more of the fuel. If this is your observation, then you are ignoring a control somewhere. That's the point that 96capricemgr has been trying to drive home. You won't necessarily burn 2.5 times as much; most fuels don't make peak torque and power at their stoichiometric ratio. You will burn a LOT more, though. Twice as much is usually a very good guess, but the fact that Methanol has a single boiling point instead of a distillation curve like gasolines adds the whole evaporative cooling effect into the equation. Stupid ideal gas law . . .

But what do I know - as a chemist I'm just one of those idiot scientists who always get things wrong.

[Fireballferkey]

But what do I know - as a chemist I'm just one of those idiot scientists who always get things wrong.
Hey it takes a big man to addmit the hard facts of life. :j/k: :hello: